1985 GL1200 Limited Edition Fuel Injectors

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Rednaxs60

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Looking to do some maintenance on the FI system, specifically the fuel injectors. After 32 years think a cleaning recalibration may be in order - spray patterns diminish and the internals do get gummed up. Looking for a shop here in Victoria, BC that can do this work, but no joy so far.

In my review of the various threads since I bought this bike, I found posts that mentioned that the1985 Honda Prelude fuel injectors and the '85 LTD fuel injectors are the same. Other parts such as the fuel pump is apparently the same.

I have found injectors for an '85 Honda Prelude on EBay, set of four, for around $125.00 CDN shipped. If these are compatible, not a lot of sense in having the old ones overhauled.

This is a thread from the Goldwing Facts regarding this information: https://www.goldwingfacts.com/forums/2-g ... parts.html

Anyone have information similar to this?

Cheers
 
Have been using SeaFoam every now and then, works well but is no substitute for a good cleaning and recalibration.

Have been reading various threads of late and carbs are being overhauled. This got me to thinking about the FI models and injectors. After 32 years fuel items tend to get a bit varnished/gummed up no matter what you do. I'm thinking fuel injectors are less forgiving than carbs. Fuel quality/cleanliness is debatable at best as well.

In this cooler weather, the bike does not idle the best on start. After a minute or so will idle without assistance. Not a lot to adjust on these FI models so I'm looking at what maintenance can be done to make this situation better.

Have tested the TPS to ensure it is within spec - it is. Not going to play with the TPS as these are not available and I do not want to get into a mod of it (I know there is one and have the info on it). Gerald in Pumphandle Saskatchewan has adjusted the TPS on his LTD and has found that adjusting it to th lower end of the specification has resulted in better fuel economy and spark plug burn. I'll wait until I get my second LTD on the road and out here in BC before I do any tweaking of the TPS.

When I see the price of a carb kit for a 1200, 4 injectors for around $125.00 CDN that you just do an RXR is quite reasonable. Now to find a suitable replacement.

The nice thing about Honda is that for the FI models, it borrowed technology from its car products. I would surmise it would use parts and pieces that were already in production. The fuel pump for the 1200 FI models is apparently the same as that for the 1985 Pelude as well, again giving me the feeling that parts may be very interchangeable.

Thinking I might pull one and measure it up. Another issue is if I can get a set of four injectors for a very reasonable price, buy and try may be in order. I have in the past spent more and had to spend additional to get it done - not unheard of. Worst case the injectors could become a conversation piece very good paper weights. We Canadians spend upwards of $30.00 CDN for a case of 12 beers, would have to sacrifice a few for the bike.

Thanks for the information. More research to do.

Cheers
 
I don't know if it would be worthwhile for you to ship your injectors across the border, but I have great luck with this company.

I had sent them a total of 8 injectors, 4 of which were out of my 85 EFI setup, and they were able to clean and recalibrate them all, giving them a clean bill of health.

They did a pre cleaning spray to see the condition of the injector prior to cleaning.
 
I would think these injectors are old enough that maybe they can be disassembled and cleaned. Has anyone checked?
If carefully done then I see no reason to "recalibrate" them unless this is a necessary step due to normal wear?

Just curious is all and looking at these as a mechanical device and not over thinking it.
 
[url=https://classicgoldwings.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=187386#p187386:1ln6pc6k said:
joedrum » Today, 5:20 am[/url]":1ln6pc6k]
hope this all works out ..ive never had much experience with FI models

That's the beauty with these FI models, always an adventure, not for the faint of heart, but an adventure non the less. Maybe if there is more info on what parts are available and from where more of these bikes will stay on the road - less of a mystery. From my reading on the forum(s) people tend to shy away from these FI models because of parts availability.

My father told me many times to retire as early as possible, but that you will need a reason to get up every morning. So now I am retired and this bike Is one of the reasons I get up. My friends and I talk about this all the time and don't know how we worked and did everything else as well.

I am also putting my thoughts on buying and owning an older vintage bike into a journal/article for myself. I have shared it with a few close friends, but it is not for open distribution. It is mostly about the FI model as I own one. it is also good in that I have most of my information in one place in some semblance of order.

Cheers
 
[url=https://classicgoldwings.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=187393#p187393:196g8d0i said:
wingrider » 10 minutes ago[/url]":196g8d0i]
I don't know if it would be worthwhile for you to ship your injectors across the border, but I have great luck with this company.

I had sent them a total of 8 injectors, 4 of which were out of my 85 EFI setup, and they were able to clean and recalibrate them all, giving them a clean bill of health.

They did a pre cleaning spray to see the condition of the injector prior to cleaning.

Will give them a call, it's an option.
 
personally ive been wanting one a long time ...if i had one id be on it ...it amazes me how many have tried to do custom FI and the results have been dismal at best ..you would think that these yrs later someone could mod one to work better the the stock FI from 85 -86 ..appears no one has ....i do quite the modding myself as im basically retired also...it is a shame how the forums treat the FI models ...it like the SCC conversions single carb conversions thet are discounted it seems everywhere but here ...and the false info and downright ignorance know nothing discounts ...till this forum proved different ...cost is the big thing that keeps me away ..im a very low budget retiree...

it will be very interesting how your project goes ...looking forward to someone with your resolve ..results ..seems like it could boost running greatly :popcorn:
 
Just a reminder that ATF compensates some for todays crappy fuel blend and cleans injectors as well as it does carbs. Being a lubricant it also helps keep the moving parts moving.
 
[url=https://classicgoldwings.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=187402#p187402:2ov1c1xf said:
joedrum » 5 minutes ago[/url]":2ov1c1xf]
personally ive been wanting one a long time ...if i had one id be on it ...it amazes me how many have tried to do custom FI and the results have been dismal at best ..you would think that these yrs later someone could mod one to work better the the stock FI from 85 -86 ..appears no one has ....i do quite the modding myself as im basically retired also...it is a shame how the forums treat the FI models ...it like the SCC conversions single carb conversions thet are discounted it seems everywhere but here ...and the false info and downright ignorance know nothing discounts ...till this forum proved different ...cost is the big thing that keeps me away ..im a very low budget retiree...

it will be very interesting how your project goes ...looking forward to someone with your resolve ..results ..seems like it could boost running greatly :popcorn:

I have found that a lot of issues stem from a person's background. There are some items I will not mod such as brakes for a very simple reason, insurance liability. The other guy would be taken care of but not myself. I have followed some single carb conversions and there is a lot of value to doing this. I find it interesting that this mod uses Volkswagen carbs.

Motorcycling in itself is a challenge, and I think with this comes a lack of want to play with the bikes the same as a car. There are many car/truck changes/modifications that are being done and accepted as the norm. Truck riser kits, aftermarket FI systems and brake upgrades to mention a couple.

Most of the 1200s have the same issues with electronics that operate the bike; however, the '85 LTD and '86 SEi have the additional CFI system. I think that the most important part of the system is the CFI computer and there has to be a company out there that would refurbish it - read about a company in Florida that does/did this work. The TPS is the second issue, but there is a work around for it.

The FI bikes are great. Operate well and give very little problems if maintained. My son-in-law and I have discussed this issue with the FI system on his 2014 Moto Guzzi California 1400 cc bike. He is able to change the operating mode to sport, touring and wet riding. My thoughts are that the FI system is set up for touring initially, then the computer tweaks the system by changing the timing of the engine - retards the timing for the wet setting and advances the timing for the sport setting. Probably a simplification, but in essence to change the FI system on the 1200, you would have to have an add-on that would change the computer system do what some of the news bikes already have programmed into the FI system. This is way outside my expertise, and as such, I pick and chose the mods/work I do that are within my capability.

The 1200 FI models are not the mystery that some would expect, nor are the parts availability that bad.

I have a friend who rides an HD and bought a new 2016 last year. Tricked it out a bit, but has since sold it for a newer HD with the Milwaukee 8 in it. There was a couple of issues he had with the electronics and because of this he was not comfortable with the 2016 and he upgraded to a 2017 HD. The moral of the story is that old or new, there is no guarantee that yu wil had trouble free mooting, theory difference is the parts may be available. Try having a current year car repaired after having an accident, parts may or may not be available.

However, I digress. Will post my trials and tribulations as I progress.

Cheers
 
Was discussing the fuel injector replacement with my son-in-law. We discussed his Moto Guzzi 1400 California and how it has 3 operating modes and can be modded with an aftermarket chip and tuner. I mentioned there is nothing like that on the Limited or SEi. Was looking on another forum regarding the C5 tuning kit and was wondering if there was anything out there in the aftermarket to upgrade the tuning on the '85 LTD or '86 SEi, possibly a chip change, or a means to change operating mode(s) on the fly. Interesting research project coming on.

Cheers
 
You would need to compare all sensor resistances and voltages also injector durations to see if there is any compatibility between the ECU on the LTDs and the Cars. Good luck with your tinkering.
 
[url=https://www.classicgoldwings.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=188845#p188845:12hf702c said:
Ansimp » April 3rd, 2017, 4:29 am[/url]":12hf702c]
You would need to compare all sensor resistances and voltages also injector durations to see if there is any compatibility between the ECU on the LTDs and the Cars. Good luck with your tinkering.

Have been doing more research on fuel injectors on the internet - lots of info. The duration is directly related to the ECU and the inputs from the sensors. The injector opens and closes with a signal from the ECU that grounds the injector, energizing the internal coil of the fuel injector allowing fuel to flow. I am more confident in being able to replace the injectors with those from a car because all injectors of the same type as what is installed in the GW operate the same. My concern is the dimensions of the different injectors.

Taking the injectors out of the engine is quite simple. Found I had to remove the injector then disconnect the electrical connector - probably just me. Getting the rubber boot off the injector was also a process. Estimate time to remove and replace about 20 minutes an injector after all the hardware is off the bike.

This is the injector that came out of my '85. The green end is the pintle end:
GL1200 Fuel Injector.jpg
There are different injectors used in the GW. Mine are the blue dot injectors - haven't found out what the blue dots mean:
GL1200 Fuel Injector - Blue Dot.jpg
In this picture you can also see the brass ring in the inlet of the injector. This is the inlet filter.
GL1200 Fuel Injector - Connector.jpg
Most injectors I viewed on line have a removable inlet filter - don't know if this one can be removed - more on this later.

I took an injector out last night and measured it. The overall length is 7.7 cm, not concerned with diameter as there is lots of room. The SMP FJ267 injector that is a direct replacement for the 1985 Prelude injector is 8.6 cm. The hole the pintle end fits into is quite deep and is in the injector holder (the goose neck piece that attaches to the engine head. The pintle end does not extend into the actual air passage. This gives me the sense that there is room for a longer injector. The fuel inlet end also appears to have room for the install of a longer injector. Saskrider on the GWDocs forum has installed and used the SMP FJ267 injector successfully in his '85 LTD. Another rider has successfully used injectors from an '85 Prelude as well - no mention of injector make/model.

I will also be looking at the idle air control valve as well. After 32 odd years it is probably dirty and needs a cleaning. This valve impacts the starting of the bike. It opens to allow air to bypass the throttle plate when idling and closes when the engine is under load. Mine works well when at operating temperature, but when first started in the morning runs a bit rough.

Cheers
 
Here is a picture of the internal design of a pintle style injector. Simple in nature. Cannot be taken apart. Only the inlet filter and external o-rings, etc can be changed.

wmfuel-injector-cutaway - GW similar.jpg
 
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