That "Tick"

[89-300ce]

Well, I finally plated my new to me first Goldwing that I purchased in February and like Jcol I'll give my impressions after a weekend of riding solo and two up.

First the bad.

I am surprised at the lack of bottom end torque from the bike. My last bike was a GSXR1100 and it had substantially more bottom end grunt, but it was also 500 lbs wet so the wing starts off with a handicap.
Like Jcol I was taken aback by the 3rd gear whine. Probably seems worse because the bike is so quiet.

The good.

The fairing is marvelous. The motor is smoooooth. The ride is better than any vehicle I've owned, it makes road irregularities disappear. The handling is surprisingly good. I love the bags and trunk. I love the exhaust sound. And most important, my wife actually suggested we extend our highway ride to a further destination, that's a first, and that's "Priceless"!!

And now a question.

I get what sounds like a valve tick at idle when cold. As it warms up the tick becomes intermittent and then fully disappears at idle. However, at about 2,000 rpm and up it's back, and it's very annoying. At 3,000 it gets lost in all the other noises but I like to loaf around at about 2,500 to 3,000 at light throttle when I can, and that "Tick" is quite audible. This is my first experience with this bike so I can't say if it was there before I did the belts or set the valves. The valves have been set twice now and they are on the tight side in an attempt to make it quieter. It didn't.

I can hear it quite clearly when I spin the motor over cold with the ignition off, but I can't pin-point it. I don't believe it's coming from the valve covers but if I had to guess I'd say it's more from the combustion chamber of # 2, right around the headgasket (using a cheap mechanics stethoscope). When warm the tick is gone when I turn it over.

How close does the piston chase the exhaust valve? Could carbon and setting the valves on the tight side give me that "Tick"?
I suspect this bike was ridden very gently by very senior previous owner so I don't doubt there is a lot of carbon buildup.

Any suggestions?

Jorg

 

[dan filipi]

I wonder if the tick could be an exhaust leak.

Mine have always ticked to some degree very much like you describe.
Odd but the left side has always been more so than the right, actually right is pretty quiet which leads me to believe something is amiss in the valve train, maybe a weak spring.
Seems to be more so on number 2 cylinder.

 

[89-300ce]

I also thought exhaust gasket but I can clearly hear it when cold with the ignition turned off, just spinning it with the starter. Also it's just as loud when decelerating.

Jorg

 

[joedrum]

sort of sounds like a dragging valve and weak spring that somewhat gets better when warm ....sounds as if you might be in need of a top end job if it dont get better its good you can hear that in top end only...

 

[89-300ce]

sort of sounds like a dragging valve and weak spring that somewhat gets better when warm ....sounds as if you might be in need of a top end job if it dont get better its good you can hear that in top end only...

I had considered that as well but was hoping for a dragging valve due to deposits on the stem :beg:
I'm running some TCW3 mixed in with my oil hoping that might clean things up. Problem is I know this bike has sat for most of it's life with very infrequent use. When the motor is shut off is there typically one valve that is propped open? I know on a car the crank usually coasts down to a few favorite positions and this is where the starter will wear the teeth on a flex plate. Maybe on my bike sitting with a valve propped open for most of its life might have weakened that valve spring?

Jorg

 

[mcgovern61]

sort of sounds like a dragging valve and weak spring that somewhat gets better when warm ....sounds as if you might be in need of a top end job if it dont get better its good you can hear that in top end only...

I had considered that as well but was hoping for a dragging valve due to deposits on the stem :beg:
I'm running some TCW3 mixed in with my oil hoping that might clean things up. Problem is I know this bike has sat for most of it's life with very infrequent use. When the motor is shut off is there typically one valve that is propped open? I know on a car the crank usually coasts down to a few favorite positions and this is where the starter will wear the teeth on a flex plate. Maybe on my bike sitting with a valve propped open for most of its life might have weakened that valve spring?

Jorg

Yep...it does happen. If you wanted to view the valves (and listen) while running, pull the valve cover, put a bucket under the head to catch the oil and run it at idle. Here is a video:
[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPKca7Oiwjs[/video]

(edit:fixed link)

 

[89-300ce]

That sounds nice. I might try that but I will have to remove my floorboards first. I'm thinking I might stick the hose from my stethoscope into the sparkplug holes while spinning the motor to try to isolate which cylinder and then pull the covers to have a closer look.

Jorg

 

[CBH]

Are you sure that it isn't the fuel pump that you are hearing? I've been told that some make a pretty loud ticking noise. I don't know if it's true or not.

 

[slabghost]

There is a spring thread started here that has a link to a source for a full set of replacement valve springs. I am looking for alternate spring sources. If it is just one weak valve the two springs can be bought seperately usually for $15 per valve.

 

[mike in idaho]

[
Jorg[/quote]
Yep...it does happen. If you wanted to view the valves (and listen) while running, pull the valve cover, put a bucket under the head to catch the oil and run it at idle. Here is a video:
[/quote]
A dial back timing light pointed at the valve gear while the engine is running will freeze the action and might enable you to see a sticking valve or rocker arm.

 

[dan filipi]

I have run with the cover off. Don't do it for long or you'll run the case empty of oil.
A LOT comes out.

 

[Omega Man]

I have the same tick, and I firmly believe it's the fuel pump system as the pump is new-ish. I mean why else would it always be the right side? The springs on the right side fail more often, I doubt it.

~O~

 

[slabghost]

I have the same tick, and I firmly believe it's the fuel pump system as the pump is new-ish. I mean why else would it always be the right side? The springs on the right side fail more often, I doubt it.

~O~

Makes sense to me.

 

[Andyb]

I have the tick as well. When I first got it, I redid the valves about 3 times thinking I had missed it somehow. I even set them tight. I gave up and have put over 10,000 miles on it since then (3 trips to DC and 3 trips to Memphis) and have had no other issues. I have decided to ignore it.

 

[Five]

I have the tick as well. When I first got it, I redid the valves about 3 times thinking I had missed it somehow. I even set them tight. I gave up and have put over 10,000 miles on it since then (3 trips to DC and 3 trips to Memphis) and have had no other issues. I have decided to ignore it.

Pretty much sums it up for me too.

 

[89-300ce]

That sounds nice. I might try that but I will have to remove my floorboards first. I'm thinking I might stick the hose from my stethoscope into the sparkplug holes while spinning the motor to try to isolate which cylinder and then pull the covers to have a closer look.

Jorg

OK, Whatever you do, "DON'T DO THIS".

I had removed the trim covers, pulled the spark plugs, and was setting up my stethoscope when it occured to me that I was just about to burst both my ear drums.

Checked the valve clearance again. All good. I've been listening to it for a while and in my case it sounds like it's coming from the left side, #2 cylinder. I went out and thrashed on it a bit. Pulls clean to red line, no smoke, no drama. Just the tick. It sure sounds like it's just one valve/rocker. I suppose it could be a wrist pin or loose ring grooves but it sounds like half engine speed and coming more from the valve seat area than the stem.

The timing light is a good trick and a friend has one that's adjustable. I'll give that a try.

Will one of these overhead valve spring compressors work? If it does turn out to be a weak valve spring and the overhead compressor works it wouldn't be a big deal to change them.

Jorg

 

[89-300ce]

There is a spring thread started here that has a link to a source for a full set of replacement valve springs. I am looking for alternate spring sources. If it is just one weak valve the two springs can be bought seperately usually for $15 per valve.

Great thread, this place is awesome.
Thanks.

opcorn:

Jorg

 

[89-300ce]

Just as an update, I've sprayed Mercury Marine Power Tune into the motor through the sync. connectors and the "Tick" at cold turnover is now completely gone. My guess is that I had/have some varnish build-up on one of the valve stems. The remaining "Tick" at cold idle and higher rpm's is still the same. I think I have two seperate issues, The "Tick" at cold idle is probably caused by a sticky valve (seeing as it's coming from #2 it kind of makes sense, sidestand, stem seals , etc.) and the "Tick" at higher rpm is probably caused by either a weak valve spring/springs or excessive clearance in the rocker assembly. I'm convinced it's not the reciprocating assembly.

Unfortunately using the sync ports as a delivery system for the PowerTune cleaner is not ideal as I can't properly get the spray into all the cylinders at the same time to flood the motor, and I really don't want to do this around the house anymore.

I only had temporary plates on the bike so I haven't had a chance to run it much, but I am going to use fuel additives and a high detergent oil to see if there are further improvements. If not I'll check the rocker assembly and springs.

Jorg

ps. Perhaps there should be a formal distinction/clarification between the use of "Tick", "Knock", and "Slap" (Vaudeville?) when describing engine sounds in these threads so that we are all on the same page.